The Good the Bad and the Ugly, Playing ISG on 25% research

Discussion in 'AAR (After Action Reports)' started by Ironsides, Jan 12, 2023.

  1. Ironsides

    Ironsides Ensign

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    So this ARR will detail some of the event that occured during my second game playing on 25% research 75% production:

    Nordheim setup.jpg

    Nordheim is my faction and a warrior Culture:

    Nordheim 25-75 Faction settings.jpg

    The starting location is in the southwest of the spiral galaxy:

    Nordheim Valhalla system turn 40.jpg
    The last 40 turns has been spent researching and exploring the surrouding region, a monster has been discovered at Doradus but not much else, the only viable system is Thutania but this has a desert planet and can not yet be colonised... all seems quite otherwise the work of building up Valhalla Prime continues...

    Turn 100 passes without serious incident , Thutania I and mars are colonised, Research now moves up to Tek level II...

    Turn 116 sees the discovery of the Ion Discharger and research has now moved on to Support ships Tek III, Leaders have come and gone during the last 116 turn, but Nordheim now has Blackwood, Kataki, Yang and 3 droid ship leaders as well as Sarla-Skak and 2 Droid colony leaders.
    The fleet consists of only 5 vanilla FFs + 1 survey ship.... and Thutania is being blockaded by monster offspring.


    Map turn 116.jpg



    Hi there... my mums not at home at the moment...

    Close encounters of the third kind Nova turn 166.jpg

    Turn 166 sees the discovery of the Nova who are light years ahead on Tek but seem peacefull enough, in a couple of turns they'll demand a "Gift" which is accepted without question and they go their merry way...

    First encounters of the third kind Nova turn 166.jpg
    Valhalla Prime is now building support ships, research is now on tek III weapons Adamantium armour has been discovered and Pike has joined the "Armada" ...

    There be Dragons...
    Dragons Domain.jpg

    By Turn 216 research is now on Tek level IV autonomous land processing, which will aid in completing civil engineering on Valhalla Prime, Thutania 1 and Venus which has recently been colonised.
    5 support ships and 3 cruisers have been built and the fleet is ready to clear out the monster from Doradus and investigate the minor civ there... ship bulding continues with more support and warships to follow...
    Diplomatic relations with the Nova have hit a low note with the arrest of their diplomat for spying, but our fleet is now much bigger then theirs on paper at least, so any threat from that direction is minimal...

    map turn 216.jpg


    Its the Palaceans...

    Its the palaceans turn 250.jpg

    Turn 250 after making contact with the Palaceans only a few turns previously, they declare a war of extermination...

    Map turn 250.jpg

    The Palceans have 11 systems (Norheim 2), at least 3X the Tek points and 8X the warship points of Nordheim as half are spent on support ships alone, intel is limited though:

    Tek comparison turn 250.jpg

    Fleet comparison turn 250.jpg

    This ends the first phase of the the game, next the slaughter begins.... but for whom?
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Jan 12, 2023
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  2. Ironsides

    Ironsides Ensign

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    Turn 251 Phase II... The Palacean War.

    Later historys recorded the Honourable Kirchenhügel leader of the Pritania Clan addressed the Council of Elders after news of the Palacean declaration:

    "Honourable Members of the Council, we will fight with growing confidence and growing strength in the void, we shall defend our world, whatever the cost may be. We shall fight in the kuiper belt, we shall fight on the moons of Jötnerheim and the plains of Asgard, we shall fight in the fields and in the streets, we shall fight in the hills; We shall never surrender.
    And even if, which I do not for a moment believe, our world or a large part of it were subjugated and starving, then our colony's beyond the skys, armed and guarded by the Nordheim Fleet, would carry on the struggle, until, in Odins good time, the New Worlds, with all their power and might, steps forth to the rescue and the liberation of the old."


    The Good, well you've got to see the good in something...
    Nordheim obtained Hyperdrive some time ago from a shipwreck and off course have Adamatium armour, are currently building new Military ships at Mars (Asgard) and Venus (Vanaheim) and about to complete the Galatic Industrial Conglomerate at Valhalla Prime (Midgard) in a few turns, also activated the "Warrior Code" after Kirchenhügel's rousing speech which will help to speed things along as well...

    The Bad, were weak in weapons having only Nuclear missiles albeit with all the trimmings, Laser, Fusion and Neutron beams, also no beam weapon or shield enhancments of any kind so attacks are weak at best, and its a sure bet the Palaceans have something considerably better...
    The Nordheim fleet consists of only 11 ships, 3 Cruisers +1 building and the Demolisher, 1 Destroyer and six Frigates...

    Valkyrei Cruiser
    Valkyrei CR turn 216.jpg


    The Ugly: Maybe we can invite them over for Lunch?...


    Turn 251 map:

    Pike turn 251.jpg

    The war started with the taking of the Goth outpost by the Palaceans, but theres no intel on how large the enemy are there or what they consist off, no matter its going to be a fight to the death in any case..
    However theres an adult monster heading for Biotania outpost and as the fleet is still returning from its five year mission, Pike takes it on himself to destroy the monster or die in the attempt...
    Other then two other smaller monsters heading for Dral and Riatune things seem omminously quiet...


    Turn 251-253
    Pike fights a 9 turn battle with the monster at Biotania but finally overcomes it before his ship is destroyed, taking heart he heads for Riatune to deal with its other smaller offspring and retake the outpost.
    The fleet finally arrives back at Valhalla and from now on will fight defensive actions to protect the system, at least untill more ships are available.
    The 2 remaining Cruisers at Valhalla head towards Dral to destroy the other offsping...


    Turn 253-254
    Pike recaptures Riatune heads back to Biotania and then to Goth to retake the out post, all one turn moves, the 2 Cruisers at Dral head for Ichat and then to Goth to support Pike...


    Turn 255-256

    Pike, Kataki and Yang retake Goth unopposes but a Palacean Battleship slips past them on a heading for Valhalla, they head to Valhalla to support the fleet.
    3 monsters appear on the radar heading for Riatune outpost and recapture it...

    Palacean BS attacks valhalla turn 255.jpg

    At Valhalla it takes the entire fleet less 1 FR to stop and disable the battleship only the missiles having any real effect, the Palacean stands off at range and launches multiple missile attacks, targated Nordheim ships withdraw from the battle rather then be destroyed while the cruisers close in finally capturing it after a stiff but short battle.
    Xeroph takes command as Admiral aboard the Orca now renamed the "Palaceans Curse" its heavily reinforced and equipped with Tek VII shields and multiple Polaris missiles!... a clumsy ship but way tougher and with more hitting power then anything Nordheim previously had.

    Note: I tried the battle twice more whilst writing this and was unable to achieve the same results and lost cruisers both times, destroyed by mass hits from the Orcas main launcher, despite the Adamantium!... Two of these would almost certainly have defeated the Nordheim fleet, the PD lasers fitted to Nordheim ships could only destroy the nuclear missile for the most past even when combined.

    Weapon refit suggestion for the Orca: 6x Polaris Fast Mirv 2x3 estimated damage 300+, more PD weapons as many as possible, as these would likely have saved the ship from many of the Norheims nuclear missiles and could have been the difference bettween victory and defeat, the one fusion beam PD was ineffective.

    Captured Orca Valhalla.jpg

    A colony ship is sent to Doradus and Athenna Demu is hired as governor boosting research, a star base is rushed into service using up the bulk of the available credits, but thought necesary to protect Valhallas flank.

    At Valhalla Prime the industrial conglomerate is completed boosting production, and a new battleship is started the "Loki" equipped with the Ion Discharger and a few neutron beams and nuclear Missles.


    Turn 257-258

    Two of the monsters that recaptured Riatune head for Doradus and Vreh the Nordheim responds by despatching two ship each to destroy them, the 2 cruisers sent to Vreh head for Riatune to retake it.
    At Valhalla the fleet has been reinforced by 2 Cruisers, the "Loki" BS is almost complete.

    Turn 259-261
    the cruisers at Riatune explore nearby systems. skirmishes contunue at Goth where an enemy destroyer is captured, a larger fleet approaches Riatune.
    Improved Logistics eta 4 turns is now being researched with a view to attacking Ezron the nearest Palacean system, to this end a bomber cruiser "Ragnarok" and 10 assault ships are being built at Valhalla eta 3 turns...

    Turn 262- 264
    Logistics is complete and the assault fleet prepares to attack Ezron moving to Goth...
    Several large fleets comprising a total of 24 monsters 2 cruisers and a destroyer converge on Riatune, smaller enemy fleets converging on that system are driven off or destroyed without loss...
    Nordheim divert some ships from the Ezron assault fleet to support the three ships defending Riatune...

    Ezron in range turn 263.jpg

    Turn 264: Attacks intensify at Riatune, reduced assault fleet heads for Ezron:

    Map turn 264.jpg


    Turn 265

    The first fleet attacking Riatune is destroyed (10 monsters) the 2 cruisers with them escape, the second fleet approching will fair no better now 15 monsters and 3 detroyers converging on Raitune.
    Ezron is succesfully invaded, Disrupter tek as well as 2 other minor teks is captured from the Palaceans, a massive boost for Nordheims Research...
    Contact with the Moltar is made.

    Disrupter captured at Ezron turn 265.jpg

    The war continues...

    Just another Bug Hunt?
    Just another bug hunt right.jpg
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2023
  3. Konstantine

    Konstantine Grand Admiral

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    I almost missed this, good to see you doing an AAR.

    Some quick thoughts.
    Finding Adamantium armor with these settings is huge, I tend to tone down events to few in order to increase the challenge, you have set them on many, meaning that your game will have a far greater randomness to it. You have specials at many as well, both a boon and a curse depending on who gets what.

    Some quick thoughts

    Designing ships means I often find myself lacking just a tiny bit of space to get the design I want, so I sacrifice, I suppose the AI does as well. For example early on my pd weapons are just lasers and they are inadequate, even if my ships stay tightly together to support one another. That's the breaks. It gets better as tech improves, but it's always a balancing act.

    Myself, I love the reduced research as the game becomes far more epic and tech far more meaningful, I hope you enjoy this ride, I'll be following.
     
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  4. Ironsides

    Ironsides Ensign

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    The Palacean War Part II.

    Turn 266

    With the Capture of Ezron and the destruction of the large monster fleets at Riatune (in total some 30+ monsters and warships), its no longer felt that Valhalla system is under direct threat, skirmishes continue at Riatune though and 2 ships are left there to defend the system...
    The rest of the Riatune defence fleet heads for Goth as this is a more central location and its possible to support Ezron and the other systems from there.

    Map turn 266.jpg

    The Palacean Fleet has taken a hit though with the captured Orca "Palceans Curse" playing a key role in the Riatune battles...

    Fleet comparison turn 266.jpg

    However Ezron will need reinforcing and skirmishes there are likely to continue for some time to come...
    Its not known if any large Palacean fleets are heading for Nordheim space as intel is still very limited.

    Diplomacy:
    The Palaceans refuse a peace treaty and declare they "regrettably" have to continue their war of extermination, Moltar are uninterested in Diplomacy of any kind, but the Nova at least seem open for business...
    It now becomes apparent the Palaceans are pursuing a war against the Moltar, perhaps this is the reason why more Palacean fleets haven't appeared in Nordheim space...

    Tek and Warship construction:
    The capture of the Disruptor tek at Ezron has massively boosted weapon Tek, allowing a new generation of warships to be designed and built, the existing designs are ungraded doubling weapons and increasing firepower by 100%, albiet at a loss in combat speed.

    Thor BS turn 266.jpg Valkyrei III CR turn 266.jpg

    Both the Thor BS and an upgraded Valkyrei are put on the stocks, The designs for the Loki BS, Baldor DS and Freya FR are also upgraded, and all existing ships will be refitted as appropriate... this will take some time though.
    In the mean time the older Cruisers remain the main fleet ship, Frigates are primarily relegated to guard, exploration and escort duty.

    Fleet Strength and future operations:
    Now consists of 2 Battleships, 10 Cruisers, 2 destroyers and 6 Frigates of obsolete design, these will defend what Nordheim has and push out toward Palacean space causing as much trouble as possible, hopefully distracting them...

    Fleet Tek Enhancements:
    Helium-3 is available but there are few sources within range, these will be occupied as soon as outpost ships are available, beam enhancers have already been researched with shield enhancers next.

    Civil Tek and Construction, the Future:
    The next phase of research will move to Civil projects in particular Terra forming and planet construction with a view to building up the current systems, there are currently at least 7 worlds and an asteroid belt under Nordheim control that would benefit from this, but this is a long term plan at the moment and will depend on circumstances.

    The Cultural capital is now being built at Venus and the Navigation Archive is next but one in the research queue.

    More Support ships are needed to aid in constuction at Ezron, Doradus and Thutania as well as outpost ships for the 2 helium-3 gas giants at Egantu and Pertinax, these will become priority for ship building once the current military projects are complete.
     
  5. Ironsides

    Ironsides Ensign

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    Thanks! I think it would be much more difficult without the Adamantium but not impossible, the Ion Discharger was less usefull as I couldn't afford the time to build a BS to house it and it really needs to be HV, but this absorbs so much space at Tek III that you end up with a ship with practically no weapons, it will come into it own now that the Nordheim have captured the Disruptor Tek...
    I did consider an AA cruiser as support for the fleet but this became unnecesary after the capture of the disrupter Tek, heres the design Tek IV weapons (H3 enhancement nothing else at Tek IV)...
    Each PD group does 10points + H3, it also has 2x the missiles of the Valkyrei so will do more damage in a single combat turn...

    I would have certainly gone for a few of these to support the fleet without the weapon Tek boost... but never got the chance to test it.

    Hydra AACR.jpg

    At other game settings initially lasers PDs worked out ok, probarbly because there was wasn't such a big disparity in the Tek which meant only Nuclear not Polaris missiles.. I think this disparity has been caused primarily by the Nova/ Palacean research treaty, the Nova always seem to lead in Tek initially though the Moltar also do well... but I dont want to give the game away.... yet.;)
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2023
  6. Ironsides

    Ironsides Ensign

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    Turn 267-269

    Reinforcements arrive at Ezron and the fleet there sets about capturing the outposts at Gri, Usagla, Ivig and eventually Govv, where there is some skirmishing with the enemy...
    Unoccupied antimatter is discovered at Usagla and an outpost ship is built at doradus and despatched with haste to claim it...
    At Valhalla two more updated Cruisers and the Thor BS are ready and head for Ezron via Goth, the ships still at Riatune return to Valhalla after despatching the Palacean stagglers there, Warships are refitting at Thutania and Valhalla as occasion demands.
    Pike decides to go a sightseeing cruise round the shoulder of Orion...

    Map turn 268.jpg


    Turn 269

    The "Palaceans Curse" has been refitted as an improved Loki BS and despatched to Ezron, old ships are gradually being recycled back to Valhalla for refit as skirmishes continue north of Ezron.
    The Moltar Declare war on the Nova.

    Loki BS Palaceans Curse.jpg


    Map turn 269.jpg

    The War Continues...
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2023
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  7. Ironsides

    Ironsides Ensign

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    Turn 270 - 278

    Skirmishes continue in the region north of Ezron, there are no major battles but the skirmishes appear to be having an effect on Palacean fleet numbers, some of this can likely be attributed to the Moltar who are still at war with the Palaceans...
    They can also no longer reach the Torbog minor civ (+2 SSP/colony) at Lithios, but this doesn't seem to stop them from building new ships.
    Its believed that the chart below only includes SSP expenditure, so all military and civilain ships but not monsters.

    So in ships at least the Nordheim have almost reached parity with the Palaceans but will rapidly run out off SSP themselves, the Norheim Fleet consists of 3BS +1 building, 11CR, 3DS, 6FR mainly refitted, so hasn't increased to any great extent.

    Fleet Comparison turn 274

    Fleet comparison turn 274.jpg

    Turn 274 The larger Picture:

    Map turn 274.jpg

    Turn 278

    The Palceans have now advanced to the East of Ezron as far as Cups, a cruiser is already exploring the region in that direction as far as possible...

    North of Ezron a small Nordheim Fleet is exploring, making trouble and seeking out targets...

    The outposts just north of Ezrom are now secured as far as is possible, as the Palaceans seem to have ceased their weak attempts to retake them.

    At Valhalla the additional needed support and outpost ships are now being built which will likely use up the remaining SSP, whilst at Thutania construction has started on the Navigation Archive after a request from the Governor.

    Tek research is now on Terraforming eta 5 turns, with the Battlestation next in queue.

    All obsolete Warships of the Fleet have now been refitted to current designs.

    Map turn 278.jpg


    Next: This is the way the war ends, not with a bang but a whimper...
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2023
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  8. Ironsides

    Ironsides Ensign

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    Turn 279-286 The Hollow Men.

    The Overall Situation:

    Diplomancy:
    Contact has been made with the Sulak who appear to have been in a serious war with the Palaceans as well, they currently have a peace treaty though this won't last much longer...
    None of the other Races are friendly, though the Nova have made no agressive moves despite the arrest of their Diplomat earlier, Nordheim currently has a succesfull trade treaty with them.

    The Fleet turn 279:

    The Northern Raiders (2BS, 2CR, 1FR) now operating close to Gladus take the outpost at Learia and Theava, in the process encountering a small enemy fleet and capturing 2 Palacean Cruisers for intel purposes (they turn out to be obsolete designs), the assault ships with them retreating to safety...
    For the time being the 2 captured cruisers are sent to take the outpost at Ivofiks, whilst the main force returns to Learia, which is under threat.

    Primary Leaders of the Northern Raiders and map:
    Leader 2 turn 279.jpg Leader 3 turn 279.jpg Norther Raiders turn 279.jpg

    Ezron Eastern Operations towards Fear and Cups Turn 279:

    The Exploration Cruiser (Blackwood) sent East from Ezron finds no systems of significance, and diverts to take the outpost at Xoth, this brings Fear into range as well as the Palacean outposts of Toalltef and Lodora.
    An expedition is dispatched from Ezron (4 CR, 8 assualt ships) to investigate Fear and destroy or capture as appropriate any enemy colonys or outposts found there, the 2 android leaders commanding the Expedition will be joined by Blackwood currently on a mission to explore the system.
    Enemy warships are seen crossing the area including Battleships...
    Finally an outpost ship plus frigate escort is sent to Cippe to occupy the asteroid belt there, this should bring Cups within range...

    Esron Eastern region Leader and map Turn 279:
    Leader 1 turn 279.jpg Ezron western operations turn 279.jpg

    Valhalla Fleet, a force (2BS, 2CR, 2DS, 2FR) is kept in reserve at Valhalla to protect the local region as far as Ezron.
    A single frigate or Destroyer is currently assigned to each of the remaining systems primarily as a guard for Civilian ships.

    Map Turn 279

    Map turn 279.jpg

    And Finally Pike returns to duty and rejoins the Fleet at Valhalla...
    "I've seen things you people wouldn't believe"...
    Pike Returns.jpg


    The Hollow Men to be continued...
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2023
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  9. Ironsides

    Ironsides Ensign

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    The Hollow Men part II.

    Turn 280-285

    The Northern Raiders, Skirmishes continue around Theava and Ivofiks with a larger Palacean force concentrating at Learia (1BS, 2DS, 3FR, 4 monsters) the attack is easily defeated with the enemy BS and 2DSs captured, these ships are sent back to Valhalla via Ezron to be refitted there.
    After dealing with several other minor fleets they head for Phin bombing the colony there, and then onto To and Draiphab capturing several more Palacean warships, and finally back to Phin to bomb the Palacean colony again...

    The eastern Expedition out of Ezron (5CR, 8 assualt ships) attacks the Palacean colony at Fear (Moltar pop) and destroys it, waits there for the outpost to be established at Clippe (which brings Cups into range) then heads to Toaltef capturing the outpost there, and finally south to attack Cups...
    A Palacean colony found at Cups is captured and the system comes under Nordheim control, skirmishes take place at Lodora where a larger Palacean fleet starts to concentrate...

    Part of the Valhalla fleet moves to Ezron as a precaution.

    The Navigation Archive is completed at Thutania +2 Starmap speed.

    Map: overview turn 280, Battle at Learia, Fear attacked.
    Map turn 280.jpg

    Map: Northern operations turn 285, Phin bombed. To outpost captured.
    Map Northern Operations Turn 285.jpg


    Map: Eastern Operations Turn 285, Cupps captured, Lodora outpost under threat.
    Eastern Operations Map turn 285.jpg

    Diplomacy:
    Turn 284, Nordheim demands Tribute from the Palaceans they grudgingly concede, however Nordheim continues attacks anyway.

    Turn 286, With the destruction of Fear the capture of Cups and the bombing of Phin, the Palaceans Surrender...


    More to follow...
     
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2023
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  10. Ironsides

    Ironsides Ensign

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    The Palacean Surrender and the Aftermath...

    Perhaps the biggest surprise of any game I've played and certainly the biggest surprise of my experience with ISG.... Lol
    The surrender of such a powerfull faction, which is No1 in the game, to the bottom of the League, is truly a David and Goliath ending to the war...
    However this cannot be entirely ascribed to Nordheim, the fact that the belligerent nature of the Palaceans resulted in multi wars back to back with apparantly the Sulak and Moltar surely had a major impact, likely making it very difficult for them to concentrate on any single opponent...
    A happy circumstance for the galaxy and in particular the Nordheim.

    Its left the Nordheim with a huge boost in research, culture, income etc... and the Largest fleet of any faction by far...
    From now on the Nordheim will be ascendant as a result of this, but also because technologically they've reached the point where terraforming is taking place and world building will soon be possible...

    The Effects of Tek on the war.
    Fairly early in the game Nordheim obtained the Ion discharger, Adamantium and Hyperdrive, of these Hyperdrive was in my opinion the most important, because without it it would not have been possible to counter many of the moves being made by the Palaceans...

    The Ion Discharger (disables most ships for 2 turns) like most of the specials is less usefull because of its high space requirement, and didn't really come into its own untill level VIII Disrupter tek was captured from the Palaceans.
    This had the effect of increasing miniaturisation of ships weapons allowing enough space for the HV upgrade to be fitted increasing effective range.

    Notes on Adamantium.
    Adamantium the strongest armour in the game, I dont often find this so it was lucky to be sure, but then I dont use its full effect that is the reinforcing of the ship structure, if the Cruisers at Valhalla early on had max structure this would have made them almost invulnerable, normally I dont strengthen ships at all mostly because I dont find it necesary, but this is a personal choice and unlike the other specials you cant choose not to use Adamantium once its found...
    I would prefer to choose armour from the available Tek but that isnt possible in the game, as a result have no idea how much space this uses on the ships.
    It should also be considered that Wurtzite canons are only level VI Tek (Palacean had Level IX) and these can penetrate armour making Adamantium ineffective, they may already have had these at the time but this is unknown.

    However if Adamantium hadn't turned up Nordheim would have certainly researched Tritanium and H3 shield enhancement sooner, although researching these would have had a knock on effect in terraforming and probably the navigation archive later.

    If the Palaceans had Adamantium they would probably have been unbeatable by Nordheim, as it was they strengthened their ships to maxiumum making them much stronger then Nordheim ships of the same class even with Adamantium ...
    The main advantage the Palaceans had in weapon tek they squandered on poor design for the most part and this had the effect of levelling the playing field despite their other advantages...

    Captured Enemy Ships.
    The Best Palacean Cruiser design captured during the War (one of 2) these would join the fleet for some time to come, other captured ships would be refitted as current Nordheim designs as they were greatly inferior to this.
    It should be noted that Nuclear missiles could have been replaced by Polaris at no additional cost, making this ship almost as powerfull as the Orca at Valhalla...

    Manta Cruiser Palacean war.jpg Sting Palacean war.jpg

    The Sting Palacean Destroyer (above) captured during the last days of the war for intel purposes, proved the Palaceans had level IX weapons tech available.
    Shortly afterwards better scanner Tek was captured at Cups, making it possibly to scan enemy vessels in advance of combat.

    More to follow...
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2023
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  11. Konstantine

    Konstantine Grand Admiral

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    What happened to you reminds me of the last game I played, I was going to do a post about that but I may as well say a few words here instead.

    Note that I play on emperor, meaning crap worlds for me near by, excellent worlds for the ai.

    So I played a session and saved at what I consider an inflection point. I continued the game playing mostly in a peaceful manner. Eventually I was overwhelmed, much like my last AAR.

    I went back to the save, and this time attacked my neighbors (the Draguul). I mean I really attacked, I didn't let up at all and conquered their territory, all of it. Now while I did damage the conquered colonies, I took them without killing off the Draguul population. Being that this was at "Emperor" setting, those worlds were rich and super-rich, mostly ideal (for the Draguul). Between the tech I picked up from my invasions, and these new productive worlds, I became unstoppable.

    That leads me to think that perhaps on the higher difficulty levels, conquered population should incur a permanent malus, even after the chance of rebellion wears off. This is similar to what Birth of the Federation did way back, or the hearts of Iron series, where a conquered territory only offers partial production (unless it's a core). It would extend the game a bit, and make "rushes" less viable. The player then would have a more balanced choice to make. Do I keep the original pops, and gain quicker but permanently reduced benefits, or do I exterminate and re-colonize?

    Just a thought.
     
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  12. Ironsides

    Ironsides Ensign

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    Phase III The building of an Empire.

    Following the outbreak of peace the Norheimer's buckle down to their real task of terraforming and planet construction, the object here is initially to develope the current systems to their maximum potential.
    Terraforming as necesary but ultimately rebuilding all barren worlds, gas giants and asteroid belts into new worlds ready for colonisation is the goal, at the present time there are 11 such bodies suitable for development.
    In the meantime more support and outpost ships are built, and ships of the Fleet are sent on five year missions to discover stange new worlds and Alien civilisations...

    Turn 313.
    All Alien Civilisations have now been identified with many new worlds discovered as well as needed resources, the newly discovered system at Wi has been colonised and is currently being developed, all other systems in Nordheim control are now almost complete, though some new planets are still to be colonised and populations remain low.
    In total Norheim now has 14 colonised worlds in 6 systems with six more worlds to follow...

    Map turn 313 the galaxy overview.

    Map turn 313.jpg

    System Development.
    Valhalla system is now almost complete with the exception of Vanaheim (Venus) which still needs atmospheric terraforming tek not yet researched, this is a typical goal for all systems under Nordheim control.
    Default planet construction for Nordheim appears to be a Medium Ice world, Rich/ultra Rich, level 2 Eco, though smaller and larger worlds can occur randomly with the current resources.
    Less then 3 antimatter is not worthwhile for planet construction as it doesn't produce ideal planets, which then require terra forming, so its a good idea to make sure enough is available before you start.

    Valhalla sytem turn 313.
    Valhalla system turn 313.jpg

    Colony development notes:
    The main goal with a new colony is to build Civil Engineering 6, any excess infratructure is used for aeorspace/planetary engineering as appropriate, this is because Civil Eng 6 provides a large bonus for developing the worlds of other systems as well, and this is accumulative (though divided bettween all the worlds of the Empire) greatly aiding in new world development in other systems.

    Numbers of support ships are also built to aid in construction on the new colony's, each system has at least one but will eventually have 3-5 with more in important systems like Valhalla, there appears to be no upper limit for this though support ships will supply a max of 100 production per ship as well as planatery engineering bonuses, this does however depend on your infranstructure levels and bonuses.

    Technology current status turn 313.
    Many of these teks were captured from the Palaceans or have been traded with the Nova, only hyperdrive and disrupter tek is missing from this view.

    Tek turn 313.jpg

    Diplomacy overview turn 313.

    Diplomacy turn 313.jpg


    The Palaceans have been havng some trouble with Moltar and are again involved in a war with the Sulak, despite the fact that "allies" are aiding them or least fighting the same enemies, they ask Nordheim to declare war and after due consideration and an attempt to contact the Moltar (which is not responding to any diplomacy what so ever) the "Council of Elders" decides to declare war on the Moltar.

    More detail Intel is needed on the Moltar, so to this end a spy is sent to investigate, but this will take a few turns yet...

    Warships in Moltar space are ordered to engage in privateering activitys much like they did in the Palacean War, attacking outposts, intercepting enemy vessels, bombing colony's, destroying or capturing ships as appropriate...
    The "Fleet" consists of 2 BSs, 3CRs and a survey vessel at present in the vicinity of Uruk, including the Ex Palacean cruiser "The Palaceans Tail"...

    In the meantime an assault fleet is being prepared at Ezron...

    The Local Situation Moltar space turn 313.

    Map turn 313 moltar space.jpg

    Next: The Moltar War, you really should talk to your neighbours!...
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2023
  13. Ironsides

    Ironsides Ensign

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    I think were on the same page here, generally its better to capture developed alien worlds with good populations, the goals of Nordheim are slightly different in that smaller or poorer systems are not considered worthwhile though beggers can't be choosers, and if the infracture is not capable of being built up to level 6 civ-eng (or unknown) its usually leveled leaving only the pop.
    The civil engineering of the other systems plus support ships and a good pop, will mean that captured worlds can be rebuilt ultra fast...

    Quality of the local systems: depends on what your goals are, Norheims goal is to create new worlds, so a system with a tiny small poor deadlocked planet but with several basic asteroid belts/gas giants will do fine, the more junk the merrier and you only need one or two to create quite a number of excellent worlds, once you have the tek...
    Nordheim is currently at this level in the AAR which means they can look for systems that are basically space junk...

    Its my thought that the higher settings have more of an effect when you play other non-human/sol-based civs, because you always start with a system capable of six good worlds...

    Better systems for the AI is a double edged sword its cuts both ways, if you capture these systems you have all their benefits where if the local systems around the player are poor they are no great loss, or gain for the AI...
    But again this may depend on what faction your playing.

    It does take a while to intergrate the pops and I dont see any reason why there shouldn't be a negative applied at higher difficulty levels...
    But suspect this may effect the AI more then it will the player, effectively cancelling it out or even giving the player an advantage of sorts... but this is speculation on my part though...

    A thought did occur to me, and that is there could be a new skill/mission for Intelligence operatives, "Foment Rebellion" this would have more effect on alien popped worlds under the targeted factions control, reducing assimilation progressively and finally creating a rebellion...

    Wishlist...
    I would like to see the ability to relocate a population to another world entirely, a planetary construction fleet capable of building worlds in a system that has no worlds only gas giants/asteroid belts...
    A "Genesis Device"(Terraform a populated world) and a planet Buster reducing the world to an asteroid belt, but this is probably taking it too far... as I can imagine what the AI would do with such a thing. Lol

    ;)
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2023
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  14. Konstantine

    Konstantine Grand Admiral

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    These are some good thoughts.

    My own goals didn't allow developing worlds and my 50% pop growth hurt as well.

    Well that's the thing, the worlds around me are suitable for the AI, hostile to me. In this case I got a bit lucky as having the Draguul as one neighbor also gave me some tolerable. Though I did eliminate a minor faction just to set up Chith I.

    More likely it will cancel out. However I wouldn't mind if the AI does not share this rule with the player on higher settings;).

    Here by the way
    The first two shots are the save point.
    In the first iteration of the session I was peaceful and the Draguul got swallowed by the Palacean...which I couldn't hold off. All the while I was also at war with the Cerixx, but they were more a nuisance.
    In the second, I rolled the Draguul and became unstoppable, I stopped once I realized I could take everyone on at once and win with my massive fleet, which dwarfed the AIs combined.

    230.jpg
    230b.jpg
    End.jpg
    Endb.jpg

    Now it seems that I may finally get to play the latest version, this game was a while ago.
     
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  15. Ironsides

    Ironsides Ensign

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    "My own goals didn't allow developing worlds and my 50% pop growth hurt as well."

    A tough choice, I guess thats means its conquer or die... reflected I suppose in the second variation.

    At the moment in the AAR there is a strong possibility that Nordheim could end up fighting the entire galaxy, because the Galactic Council convened for the first time on turn 313 (Nova and Moltar) and Nordheim was just a sideshow.
    So this made the Surrender of the Palaceans as No1 so much more important, as in the closing days of the war they allied with Nova...
    And if the surrender had been refused or never offered, depending on how much damage Nordheim could do in the intervening period to the Palaceans would have likely determined the outcome of the game, at the time I didn't know any of this so could not have prevented it.

    This is the main reason why Nordheim declares war on the Moltar at the Palaceans request on turn 313...
     
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  16. Ironsides

    Ironsides Ensign

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    The First Galactic Council meeting and the Moltar War.

    To understand why the Nordheim decide to declare war on the Moltar its necesary to look at the diplomatic and overall situation a bit closer...

    For the First time in a game at this stage that I can recall, The Galactic Council candidates do not include the player faction so this is unknown territory...

    The Nova.
    Were the Main Candidate, have good relations with many factions and appear to be actively developing this, during the vote the Ceric Sentinals supported them aginst Moltar, this vote was inconclusive.
    But the addition of the Draguul along with the Kaek vote (subjects of Draguul) in Novas favour and the uncertainty of future relations with the Palaceans, could radically alter the vote at the next Galactic Council (29 turns).

    Now bear in mind that the surrender pact with the Palaceans will run out before this, and relations with them could take a hit including not supporting them with their request of declaring war on the Moltar, but not limited to this alone as the event settings for the game are on many...
    Added to this should they break away, they would add their votes to the Novas or vise-versa as they are allies, this along with any supporting votes would likely ensure victory at the Council in a mear 29 turns...

    Nordheim would then be forced to concede or fight all the other factions...

    So because of this its thought better to foster relations with the Palaceans hopefully preventing them from rejecting Nordheim as overlords...

    Diplomacy Nova Turn 313.jpg



    The Nordheim Fleet.
    On paper the Nordheim now have the largest Fleet, but in reality more then half are non combat as there is more SSP spent on Support ships then warships, these include 5 BSs and 16 CRs of various types 6 DSs and 5 FRs.
    The DSs and FRs are not particularly strong and for the first time in any game its thought best to reinforce the structure of DSs to medium to give them a better chance in their main role of protecting outposts and systems, FR primary role is one of escort for civilian vessels allowing them to escape should they be attacked.

    Baldor III DS turn 313.
    Baldor III DS turn 313.jpg


    The Moltar War: finally to Follow...
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2023
  17. Ironsides

    Ironsides Ensign

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    The Moltar War turn 314.

    Essentially the Nordheim ships are the same as those previously described, with the exception that Flak cannon Tek has become availalble via trade with Nova, this and reinforcing of destroyers will take a while to enter service but will have little if any effect on the war.

    The Moltar Fleet .
    There is at least 1 heavy BS and 3 heavy CRs supported by a small numbers of DSs and FRs in Moltar space, its not known how many are building but they are capable ship builders and completion times seem short.
    What is known is that the Moltar have Disrupter and level VII shield Tek and overall are at a much higher Tek level then Nordheim, Disrupters are fitted to almost everything with the exception of some bomber cruisers, though the short range of their disrupters and lack of missiles in many ships is likely to be a significant disadvatage in combat.

    Typical Moltar CR and BS:

    Moltar CR turn 314.jpg Moltar BS turn 314.jpg

    In anycase their now at war with 3 factions, this is effectively a land grab and war of annhilation, its important though for Nordheim that they come out on top and to this end Kle and Ke are targeted for invasion as these will quickly provides 7 more worlds for the Empire, whilst the Northern fleet near Uruk will deal with the systems there for the most part...

    Map turn 316 Moltar space.

    Moltar space turn 316.jpg

    By turn 316 the Ezron Assault fleet has captured Kle IV the rest will follow quickly.

    The Northern fleet Having attacked Demia, Zrops and the Moltar capital at Leeku is now on its way to Marsell, during the previous turns three Moltar Bombers CRs have been captured and are now part of this fleet, the fleets bomb capacity is now 15, turning it from a nuisance to a colony killer, it continues on its voyage of destruction.

    The Moltar Battleship approaching Ivig will also be captured, theres almost nothing left to fight or capture...

    Its the considered opinion amongst the Nordheim Captains that this is Not an Honourable war...


    To follow: The End of the Moltar
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2023
  18. Ironsides

    Ironsides Ensign

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    By Turn 318:
    Our Spy is now providing usefull intel on the Moltar...

    Kle system is ready to fall and Nordheim is blockading Ke in preperation for the planned capture of the system, with most of the bomber and assault fleet currently on its way from Kle, there is little opposition from the Moltar with mostly a few DSs, FRs and a few CRs but these are swiftly intercepted and dealt with...

    The Northern Fleet is now at Leeku where it has devasted the colony there, this will continue on to the Moltar Colonys of Zrops, Oyeet, Brialders and Uigawa to do the same there, bombing raiding and capturing any Tek or resident Colony Leaders where possible...

    The Palaceans are massing several large fleets at Toaltef and Binvithea as well their ongoing attack on Hokt system, in total there are at least 44 ships, including monsters and ASs comprising these fleets... one eye is cautiosly kept on them but its not thought thay are any immediate threat to Nordheim...

    The Nova have a fairly decent fleet but are not producing bombers or ASs, so take no real part in the War... and since the Dip status with Nova is congenial they are not thought to be any threat, though a 3rd fleet is being prepared at Valhalla as a reserve and to reinforce the Nordheim defence there....

    Moltar Space turn 318:

    Moltar space turn 318.jpg


    Turn 329:

    The last Moltar colony was destroyed a few turns earlier (unfortunatly not saved) and Nordheim have moved on and are primarily concentrating on exploration, planet development and constuction.

    The diplomatic situation is OK but this can rapidly change...

    Tek has improved greatly with the capture of much from Moltar but also trading with Nova, currently Nordheim are No1 overall.

    Map turn 329:

    Map turn 329.jpg

    To follow the Draguul war and the Galactic Council vote...
     
    Last edited: Jan 26, 2023
  19. Ironsides

    Ironsides Ensign

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    Phase IV: The Draguul War, The Beginning of the End.

    Turn 338:

    Little is known of the Draguul and up to now they've taken little part, although Nordheim had negotiated a trade deal with them which proved to be short lived, for some reason despite the friendly Dip position they have attacked an outpost at Oyaksee declaring war.

    A spy is despatched to the Draguul to investigate but this will take sometime, in the meantime since negotiations are not possible at present, a Fleet is despatched from Valhalla, this includes a newelly commisioned Titan the "Odin" (the first) equipped with Combat jump capability and the latest weapons etc.
    The "Odin" will be supported by a small fleet of ex Moltar Bomber Cruisers, the "Palaceans Curse" (now refitted) a Command cruiser and a dozen or so assault ships, intially they'll head for Gidurn and then on to Oyaksee.

    Map Turn 338:

    Map turn 338 Draguul war.jpg
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2023
  20. Ironsides

    Ironsides Ensign

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    The Draguul War (Continued)

    Turn 341:
    The outpost at Oyaksee has been retaken and the bulk of the Fleet has moved on to Peu where it is currently capturing the Draguul colony's there, a second fleet in the meantime was despatched to Wi and from there its now poised to attack Benja in the heart of Draguul space

    Map turn 341 Draguul space:

    Map turn 341 Draguul war.jpg


    The Galactic Council Vote turn 341-2:

    Norheim are now candidates but the vote is indecisive with only the CS siding with the Nova, even if all factions voted for Nova it wouldnt be enough for a decisive vote without the Palaceans, good news for Nordheim!

    Galactic Council Vote Turn 341-2.jpg

    Turn 344:

    The First fleet after capturing the Draguul colony's at Peu moved on to Sliux where they destroyed the enemy colony's, and are currently en route to investigate the system of Termi.
    The Second Fleet at Benja has reduced the colony's in readyness for an assault, but were attacked by most of the remaining Draguul fleet, the battle was short and resulted in the Draguul loosing most of their fleet with their Piranha flagship being captured.

    Its decided that the assault at Benja will be called off for the time being and the Second Fleet heads for Fleso to join the Odin (acting independantly) to investigate the colony's there.
    Some raiding by the few remaining Draguul ships is also taking place but this is easily dealt with.

    The More emmediate threat is now the Kaek (who are subjects of Draguul) as they have several fleets in the region...

    Map turn 344:

    Map turn 344 Draguul war.jpg
     

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